lost the shine

Well, I don't know how I did it, but I had a beautiful clear coat on my 2nd demo tank, and I wet sanded with 1200, then rubed it with polishing compound, and then buffed it. The problem is, the shine just isn't there like it was. what do I need to use and how do I need to use it, to get the beautiful shiney finnish back ?

[ArtWorld]

Kd, How many layers of clear was on it or before you sanded?

[KDSilverBrush]

It had 2 tack coats and 3 wet coats, I believe.

[ArtWorld]

Sorry I forgot to ask where any of the graphics raised a bit still after clear? Or where the graphics pretty flat? Also do you know if it was a high solid clear(Thicker clear)?

[lsabourin]

KD, sand it down again with 1200, re-clear. Then take it through 1200, 1500, and 2000 WET. Buff with 1) fine cut compund and the white 3M pad, then 2) swirl remover and 3M black pad. OR start from 1200 WET and on

L

[Kicks]

Well, I don't know how I did it, but I had a beautiful clear coat on my 2nd demo tank, and I wet sanded with 1200, then rubed it with polishing compound, and then buffed it. The problem is, the shine just isn't there like it was. what do I need to use and how do I need to use it, to get the beautiful shiney finnish back ?

If you have two tack coats and three full coats of clear on there I see no need to reclear again. You should have plenty of clear there to work with. To start with you should be finish sanding with at a minimum of 2000 wet and dry before you start any polishing. A little more information would help as well,... you say that you rubbed it with polishing compound,... what kind, and are you hand rubbing or using a buffer? Are you using only the one product, or are you using a polishing glaze after the compound? Are you using wool buffing pads or foam?
It can take a lot of buffing to bring that shine back after sanding with 1200.

[KDSilverBrush]

ArtWorld, It was a 4 to 1 with a little reducer, graphics are laying mostly flat.
Isa, thanks for the info, didn't know I needed to do all that just to buff it.
Kicks, I have 2 tack coats and 2 clear coats on it, I used Turtle wax polishing compound and scratch remover, I buffed it by hand first, then with the buffer. Thats all I did, nothing else. I used a wool buffing pad.

[waterboyjlw]

KD, I've done a some clear coat spraying, polishing and buffing, probably not as much as some of the pros here but.... First, BUFFERS ARE DANGEROUS IN THE WRONG HANDS! I've seen a couple of paint jobs ruined by a buffer, it doesn't take much and it can happen real quick. Rpm of the buffer has to be correct for the compound and pad combination being used (and actually you need to be able to adjust the rpm from beginning with a coumpound to the middle and a different speed to finish that coumpound with). I always wet sand to 2000 and then use a wool pad with my "rough" coumpound (i forget the Meguirs Number), then a course foam pad with next polishing compound, and last a fine foam pad with the glazeing coumpound. You also do not want to use the same pad/buff for different coumpounds without a real good cleaning (I have dedicated pads for each coumpound)Oh yeah, then hand wax. what you are describing sounds like you just "dulled" up the clear (assuming there is still enough left) and need to use the next couple of coumpounds to finish getting your shine back. Yuotube has several videos and I believe Meguirs website also has some real good ones showing proper way to buff and the steps needed to get a nice flat shine. Hope this helps. If you really want to know what Meguirs numbers I use let me know and I'll run out to the shop a get them for ya.

[KDSilverBrush]

Thanks for the info Waterboy, and welcome to the forum. I'm just so disapointed and frusterated right now, not sure what to do to it to get the shine back. I think Isa is right, I need to just re spray it, but I have put the polishing compound on it, and am kinda nervous about respraying, don't want the clear to bubble or fisheye, or whatever it may decide to do................sigh................ there has to bo some kinda compound that will bring back the shine. I rubbed and rubbed on this tank, used the polishing compound , and hand buffed it some more, and a bit of the shine has returned, but not the gleaming shine it had, just a dull kinda shine.

[waterboyjlw]

KD, Thanks for the welcome. Thats the samething that happened to me the first time I tried to buff out my clear. I was really bummed because it looked so much better before I tried to polish it (but not quite perfectly flat - so I'll just buff it real quick). That was when I learned about polishing a clear coat. To do it right (and get the results your looking for) it is not quick, easy, or cheap (Need a Varible Speed Buffer, Pads, and several compounds - about $300). The easy way to fix it is to reclear it like your planning. Wash with soapy water a couple of times(dawn dish detergent works well), then use lots of pre-clean and then some more, should be ok. Good Luck

[OzDesigns]

Originally Posted by waterboyjlw

BUFFERS ARE DANGEROUS IN THE WRONG HANDS!

Tru dat, it is all about friction not pressure. I go as light as possible with my buffer. It takes longer however I rarely get swirl marks. Too many RPMs or too much pressure = ruined. This is also why hand buffing is the suxor. Not enough RPMs in the forearm.

Originally Posted by KDSilverBrush

Thanks for the info Waterboy, and welcome to the forum. I'm just so disapointed and frusterated right now, not sure what to do to it to get the shine back. I think Isa is right, I need to just re spray it, but I have put the polishing compound on it, and am kinda nervous about respraying, don't want the clear to bubble or fisheye, or whatever it may decide to do................sigh................ there has to bo some kinda compound that will bring back the shine. I rubbed and rubbed on this tank, used the polishing compound , and hand buffed it some more, and a bit of the shine has returned, but not the gleaming shine it had, just a dull kinda shine.

Sorry to hear about the frustration, been there! Another option is to take it to a pro shop and see how much it would cost to fix it for you. Even though it may cost you a little, it is better than doing it all over again.

If you want to invest in a buffing kit you are probably looking at about $150-$200. (buffer, pads (wool, and foam), compounds (cutter, polisher, and glaze).

Good luck!
Oz

[Bill]

KD, I too am not a pro but I have polished a lot things over the past 30 years. I agree with many of the others here. Keep polishing! You have a lot of clear on there and if the Turtle Wax stuff you used is what I have used in the past it just won't get the job dun. Mequires make some very good polishes and there are many different levels of cut. You can't get there with one or two levels. And, most good polishes are paintable. Don't buy any that are not. To get that glassy shine will take a machine polisher and final glaze when your done polishing. As Waterboy said, be careful with machine.

What kind of air power do you have? I have recently purchased a very nice set of pads that fit on a small right angle air grinder. With the air pressure low this works great on small things like motorcycle tanks.

The other Bill

[waterboyjlw]

Oh Yeah, if you want to do the polish thing, I have had good results using Meguirs #1, #3, then #9, then a carnuba wax. I use buffs from "Buff and Shine", good quality and easy to change from one to another. some people prefer to use a machine glaze instead of #9. Nothing wrong with that, just have to buy another buffing pad. You can get the shine back, You can even level orange peel with proper buffing, but it isn't alot of fun (messy coumpound flung around the shop and your clothes).

[KDSilverBrush]

Well, I don't mind messy, but sounds like, when ya come right down to it, I need to re clear and start over. Thanks for all the great info ya'll, I don't think my lil buffer is quite up to this kinda work............

[OzDesigns]

Awesome thread!

[threadjack]
BTW: Does any1 have a preference on brands? Meguiars, 3M, Mothers? I use auto magic it is cheap but works great. I have heard that Mothers is the best and that it takes the least amount of time to buff/polish/glaze. [/threadjack]

[waterboyjlw]

Originally Posted by OzDesigns

Awesome thread!

[threadjack]
BTW: Does any1 have a preference on brands? Meguiars, 3M, Mothers? I use auto magic it is cheap but works great. I have heard that Mothers is the best and that it takes the least amount of time to buff/polish/glaze. [/threadjack]

I've only used Meguirs last 8 years, works for me, so can't compare it. It took a little while to get a good feel for it and I don't want to learn a new Brand, or replace buffs. And I don't have to polish/buff real often either.

[ArtWorld]

KD, 2 coats can be kind of thin for covering artwork if starting with 1200 sandpaper to wetsand and buff unless it was a high solid clear(very thick).

If high solid, you should be able to prep sol a few times to remove every little bit of the turtle wax compound. Wetsand with 1500 the entire tank. Be very carefull on and around the edges, they tend to burn through if not carefull enough and then you have to re clear anyway. Wetsand the entire tank with 2000. Than all you need is some 3M perfect-it II rubbing compound and a foam compounding pad. This compound is meant to get rid of 1200, 1500 and 2000 sand scratches. Also get some hand glaze and folow directions. It should be shiny as heck before you use the handglaze.

Now if it is not a high solid clear coat. Degrease and dewax the heck out of it a few times. Than 800 wetsand the whole thing staying away from edges. Than go over the whole thing with a red scuff pad including the edges. Prep sol again. Tack coat a few times and clear a few more times.

Hope this helps.
Brad

[landsbro]

hmm,,are you sure there's no silicone in the compound,
can also be that the clear hasn't cured completely,
and if you are using to much polish compound it leaves a film on the surface
and the buffer slides on this with less effect,

me myself use 3G polish compound with good result then i add 3M Perfect-it III (machine glaze)

[Bill]

KD and others. This has been a great thread. Wether it's polish, paint or beer sometimes it's best to stick what you like. I have been using Meguires for about ten years now and I am familiar with it. I tried 3M and I guess it worked just as good but went back to Meguires.

This could turn out to be a tpugh learning experience for you KD. I know how painful it is to start over. I've done it many times. But, you won't know the limit until you go past it. I have a friend that is so afraid of cutting through the clear that all of his paint jobs are not properly sanded and polished at the edges. He just did black car and the body work was flawless. But each panel looked like it was framed in orange peel.

If this is for a customer and you're on fixed price, then clear it again. If not, you might want to consider pushing the limit.

Landsbro, I just checked all of my Meguires polishes (not wax) and they all say "Paintable, safe for shop environment."

Again, this has been a great thread and this type of thing is what makes this forum so awesome!

[KDSilverBrush]

Ya'll have been so helpfull, and I am so apreciative of all the great sugestions and info you have shared with me. I ended up re clearing the tank, took it into the shop this am, and the guys went wild over it !!!!!! It was such a rush to see people react to my work like that ! They even hung it while I was there, said they wanted to protect it and wanted everyone to see it. I'm still reeling from thier reactions. The other tank got the same reaction from people in the other shop. Don't put a ladder up for me, cause I don't ever wanna come down from this cloud ! Thanks again you guys, don't think I coulda done it without all the advice from ya's :-) I'm gonna post pics of this tank in post pics of your work section, you guys deserve to see it.

[patoche]

Hi

I use 1200 wet to down the orange peal if i get too much . otherwise , i start directly with 1500 wet .
After , i jump with the Trizact 3M p3000 wet , with this sanding pad, you remove all the 1500 scratches and already get back the shine (almost like a satin effect).
Then i continue with buffing stage
-Orange pad with fast cut 3M (2 times)
-White pad with finess it 3M (2 times)
-black pad with finess it (2times)

pat

[darrenleck]

I'm new to airbrushing but been painting cars for years outside of a booth - so getting a good finish is important for me and my livelyhood. ive painted and cleared a few helmets and using my knowledge from cars i have put together a very efficient method (for me at least)of creating a long lasting and deep lustre shine. here goes-1st gripper and flash for 5 mins 2nd gripper and flash for 5 mins-2 wet coats and cure. wet flat with 1500 and relacquer with 1 gripper and 1 wet.if you have no contamination on the surface you can split the remaining lacquer (making it 50/50) with thinners. be careful of runs here though as its dead easy to get em. cure the item de-nib it with trizact (3m product) and polish and wax. this is a much lomger process for helmets than it would be for a run of the mill bumper repair due to the scrutiny it will be under. any comments gratefully recieved as I need to know everything guys.

[Stroke'n it]

I know this post is alittle old, but I have a question about polishes and color sanding. I use 3M products for my truck, because I was told that its one of the best products out there, and it comes out very nice. There's still some swirls, but not to many. The one thing that I haven't done on the truck, was color and and then buff. Do the 3M products still work the same when color sanding? I'm very afraid of color sanding my baby(truck) and ruining it. But I would like to bring the shine back to new again. I have a Craftsman buffer, and the store told me that it doesn't burn the paint. It has a low enough RPM that will not hurt the paint. But I don't have the foam pads for it, I only have the wool ones. I do change the pads for different compounds. Does the foam pads really make that much of a difference? Sorry for so many questions. Heres some pics of my baby and the products I use.
Terry

[dtownpainter]

Kd I wet sand my clear with 1500 grit wet sand paper. I then use a three step compund system with my buffing wheel.I start off with 3M extra cut compound,Then I use the 3M finess it compound. I use a wool pad with those two. I then switch to a foam pad and use the 3M foam pad polishing glaze. If you put two tack caots and three wet coats of clear there is no need to re-clear you have more then enough to work with. Hope this helps you out.