Thread: Need a cutout view of an Hp-Sb

Hello, it's the second time that I have this single problem... I've been painting for years now and never learned that I do need a second airbrush in case mine broke in the middle of a job...

So basically my problem is that there is a small piece of dried paint stuck inside the air conduct under the airbrush. So when the air is flowing in that area, the little piece of dried paint is moving thus creating a turbulence in the air flow.

As it is molded in that place i don't have access to remove that paint...

It's simply ruining my lines as the air doesn't flow properly. I do think it can only happen with an Iwata hp-sb as it is side feed. I would need a detailed cutout view to create a tool to clean that area if possible...

Don't ask if my needle and my nozzle are in good shape, they are ! The problem is a little bit more complicated.

Thank's for your help !

Ster 1

I need something that look more like this one, but for a Hp-Sb...

My airbrush is now sitting in a reducer can hopping the paint will melt...

thank's

I have the same one Don has Sterone, I'll keep looking for ya......

I'm just haveing no luck locating a cut out like you need, Sterone....

For now I'm just thinking about a way to insert a pipe cleaner in it or something like that, but I don't think my pipe cleaner will do the job efficiently, because I do believe the air is flowing in the side to side pipe to suck the paint out of the cup being a syphon feed. An Hp-Sb is quite different from a gravity feed that don't need the same air pressure in it, so I don't believe the cut out view I posted previously is accurate, especially for a side feed airbrush.

I may be wrong but I looks like there is an air conduct between the two sides of the pipe in which you put the paint cup... Or they did some grooves for nothing in that pipe !

For the tool I am also thinking about an ultrasonic cleaner. I heard it's not that good for an airbrush, but my problem being in an area that I can't access, I will probably try it. (I will ask a tattoo shop if they can help me, as I don't want to buy one.)

Anyways, I read somewhere that it's not good for the small gaskets to use an ultrasonic cleaner, but I removed every single ones to be sure...

If you have some other idea, I would really appreciate your help !

Originally Posted by KDSilverBrush

I'm just haveing no luck locating a cut out like you need, Sterone....

I am seriously thinking about grinding my airbrush until I see a real cut out view like I need. But I want a new one before, 'cause I'm in the middle of a job and I need to finish it... It would be quite nice for a revenge against my breaking airbrush, to show it who the man is...

Thank's...

I am working on a series of one off t-shirts. I am kinda painting on t-shirts like I usually paint on canvas.

I usually paint murals, helmets and canvas, but I wanted to make a publicity for my website... I rarely paint on t-shirts, I use base coat more that anything else... except on canvas.

May I post my website address here ? I know sometimes its rude to do so so that's why I ask...

So this is mainly old stuff as I need to upload the older stuff first, but I wish you'll think it's worth a look !

STER 1 | Airbrush Québec

If you submerge your airbrush in liquids (water, solvents, cleaner, paint, etc.) then you expose all kinds of areas to materials they were never meant to deal with. That includes the air passage that runs below the body of the airbrush and the airvalve assembly, the trigger well and the handle.

By submerging your brush, you let those liquids, and the paint or finish debris they carry or remove, float into areas and settle.

If you really have something in the air passage, you need to remove everything from the airbrush;the airvalve assembly, the handle, the needle, the needle chuck, the spring, etc., from the back end, and the needle, needle cap, the nozzle and the nozzle cap from the front end, then let the airbrush soak in the appropriate solvent to soften up the paint. Avoid the ammonia based cleaners like the plague, especially for doing this kind of thing.
After the body has soaked for a day or so, put the needle back in, this will act as a plug of sorts, use clean air, and blow through the front end of the brush. With the side entrance for the paint reservoir/cup blocked off, the paint and solvent will be forced back through the air passage, and out through the opening in the airvalve area where air would normally come into
the brush. It may take a round or two of this to get anything out.

From your description, I would guess that it is more likely that you have gunk in your nozzle cap, or in the well that surrounds the nozzle in the brush. But if it is in the air passage, then you now know how to get it out.

Don't soak or submerge your airbrush(es) anymore!

As far as a cut away view, the only difference between the view for the SB and the C model that Don posted is that the reservoir is mounted on the side rather than the top. The rest of the design is the same, including the air passage below the airbrush and it's access.

Thrust me, If I did remove all the small gaskets, like I said prevoiusly, my airbrush can't be more disassembled ! I'm just soaking the body of the airbrush...

This is my second airbrush and I never had any problems like this with my older one. I already tried everything that Fontgeek said, my air cap can't be more clean, as for the rest of my airbrush. Unless I would not be searching for a solution that much (I've been cleaning my airbrush with no problems for more than 10 years). The air isn't flowing freely in the air conduct, I can hear the turbulence by blowing some air in it with the nozzle, needle, and everything else removed.

I'm using base coats and acrylic and I soaked the body of my airbrush in base coat solvent, with no good results for now, as far as I know...

I think I will try the ultrasonic cleaner...

It could be possible, but it there chrome inside ? Anyway, this is a 3 years old airbrush, it happened when I first had it and it happening again after 3 years...

Submerging your brush is probably what got you into this situation to start with.
When your airbrush is operating, air passing through the air passage and nozzle cap keep any paint or debris from going back into the air passage. The holes and passages are so small that the paint would dry and pack up before it got into them.
When you submerge your brush in liquid, you are subjecting the paint passage, the trigger well, the air valve, the handle and rear assembly to materials they were never meant or designed to come in contact with.
The paint and debris float along in the solvents, but they are heavier, and tend to be stickier too, so they get into all kinds of nasty places.

If you are soaking/submerging your airbrush I hope to God you have removed the airvalve and trigger assembly along with the rest of the removable pieces, if not, then you are probably making things even worse. If you do have those things removed then plug up the needle passage and the reservoir/cup opening, and blow through the front of the airbrush, and hope that whatever you have in the air passage gets blown back through to the opening where the airvalve connects. Those same openings into the nozzle area are so small that a flake of chrome would more than likely block off the air passage competely rather than cause the "turbulents" you told us about. Either way, if the whole front end of the brush is TRULLY clean and you are still having the issues, then it means it's in your air passage or in the airvalve itself.

From what I've seen of the manufacturing process, the airbrush bodies are dipped in the chrome, so depending on the time and care of the manufacturer, the chrome may or may not have made it into the air passage, either way, unless you use ammonia or something else that's distructive to the chrome and brass, it shouldn't have effected the chrome within the airbrush.

For the last time (and not the least, I wish), I did remove everything from the airbrush... Every single things that could be removed were removed. This including the air valve, the air valve gasket, the lock screw, everything that you can order as a gasket or as a removable part was removed, cleaned, inspected with a magnifying glass and kept aside during the soaking process. I usually never soak my airbrush to clean it, never. But as I cannot access the air passages, I did it ! As There was no other possible way to see what's going on in there I soaked it: With no good results.

By being forced to stop the job I was into, I started to clean my oil compressor as well. There was some small hard parts in the air tank that may have been sucked inside my airbrush... I'm still searching for the cause of that issue, but I have an humidity filter, so again I'm not sure it could be the cause of my problem.

I don't have time to try it again today, but I did put my airbrush into an ultrasonic cleaner. (with ALL the parts removed, héhéhéh) I will tell you if it is positive later.

Thank's for your help, it's really appreciated to have some support.

dang, Sterone, I sure hope the ultrasonic cleaner solves your problem. I know how frusterating a problem like this can be, especially if you have unfinnished work waiting.

I think our communication problems are because of a language barrier, and information left out of descriptions or just plain confusion.

If you are going to use the ultrasonic cleaner, have your airbrush standing up in the US (ultrasonic cleaner) with the nozzle end pointing up, and the airbrush body submerged in the liquid. This lets gravity help dislodge whatever might be lodged/stuck with the airbrush body itself. That having been said, I would disassemble the airvalve and do a through cleaning and inspection. Just because this happend on only one of your brushes doesn't mean that the threat isn't there for all your brushes.

I think that the likelyhood of debris from your tank getting through your watertrap filter, regulator, hose, and airvalve, only to get lodged within the airbrush is almost none existant. It might be chrome or brass flakes that have broken loose from somewhere within the airbrush itself. But it is far more likely that the issue is the paint itself (providing the brush is trully clean). The difference in the nozzle size between this brush and your other brush means that it, the SB, will be much more finicky about spraying.
Just because a liquid will spray through one brush doesn't mean that it will work the same in another brush.
Think of it like gravel going through your garden hose/pipe, it will go through without much of an issue. Try to pass that same gravel through a drinking straw, and you can see the problem. That smaller opening won't let the same material go through as easily. Sure, some of the finer bits of gravel (liquid) will spray, but as soon as you get to the bigger chunks they block up the normal flow.

Te smaller the nozzle and needle size the more important the reducing, mixing and straining of your paint becomes. You may be able to spray heavier liquids through your SB but it will take more pressure to get it to atomize, and again, that's only good if the paint is strained to remove the solids from it BEFORE it goes into your brush.

The SB is primarily a gravity feed brush, that is that it uses gravity to push the paint into the airbrush then into the path of the of the air, to be drawn out past the needle and the nozzle. It uses a bit of siphon action as the volume of paint is depleted in the fluid reservoir/cup.

Your cutaway view isn't even accurate for a standard top gravity feed brush. IT doesn't show the paint passage from the cup into the airbrush body, or the trough at the bottom that the paint sits in or the needle passes through on it's way to the fluid nozzle.

Many airbrush companies cast the air passage as a separate piece and weld it to the airbrush body along with the housing for the airvalve assembly just before chroming is done. I've seen a few brushes from several manufacturers where the air passage and or the fluid reservoir has broken away from the body of the airbrush itself. When you do a careful inspection of the airbrush body, you may see a couple of welded spots or marks where the pieces are connected to the main body itself.

If you can't get your airbrush working, I would call or email Iwata/Media and explain to them what the symptoms are, how old your brush is, and what you have done to try to remedy it. Ask them for advice, or see if you can send it to them for service or replacement on the neccessary part(s).

If you can spray straight air through the brush without any issues, then you have eliminated the air passage, airvalve, etc., as being the cause for your problems. If you can't spray only air through your brush, then you have something interfering with the flow or passage route. That doesn't mean that that is the only issue, but eliminate whatever you can from the possibilities.
If Iwata won't help, you can send it to me, I'll do what I can to fix it. My work will be free, but parts (if necessary) and shipping costs will be yours.

Yeeeeaaaaahooooooo! I got some news today! An ultrasonic cleaner is an incredibly nice invention! My airbrush works like a new one, the spraying is perfect and I can continue to work ! After I came back from the tattoo shop, I was pretty sure it wasn't working, but as you can see this just worked well.

Before the ultrasonic cleaner I wasn't even able to spray water with my brush, to tell you how bad the situation was.

I am waiting for my new airbrush to be shipped, as I ordered a new one just in case this ever happens again. I'm laughing alone in my workshop, as I am really happy with the results !

If you ever encounter that kind of problem, remember that tattoo artists are very kind !

great news Sterone! Glad ya got it fixed.

Originally Posted by fontgeek

I think that the likelyhood of debris from your tank getting through your watertrap filter, regulator, hose, and airvalve, only to get lodged within the airbrush is almost none existant. It might be chrome or brass flakes that have broken loose from somewhere within the airbrush itself. But it is far more likely that the issue is the paint itself (providing the brush is trully clean). The difference in the nozzle size between this brush and your other brush means that it, the SB, will be much more finicky about spraying.
Just because a liquid will spray through one brush doesn't mean that it will work the same in another brush.

I never used any other airbrush than an Hp-Sb... So there is no nozzle size difference between my old airbrush (that doesn't work anymore) and my actual one.

Originally Posted by fontgeek

Te smaller the nozzle and needle size the more important the reducing, mixing and straining of your paint becomes. You may be able to spray heavier liquids through your SB but it will take more pressure to get it to atomize, and again, that's only good if the paint is strained to remove the solids from it BEFORE it goes into your brush.

Even water would not flow properly so there is in no way a problem with the reducing, mixing and straining of my paint. I've been painting for 10 years, so I do think, I know what I am talking about !

Originally Posted by fontgeek

The SB is primarily a gravity feed brush, that is that it uses gravity to push the paint into the airbrush then into the path of the of the air, to be drawn out past the needle and the nozzle. It uses a bit of siphon action as the volume of paint is depleted in the fluid reservoir/cup.

This is wrong, the Hp-sb is a syphon feed airbrush. The inside straw that goes in the bottom of the side cup, and the side cup itself is so small that gravity will not help in any way the paint to flow inside the body of the airbrush. A gravity feed airbrush doesn't have the paint to pass in such small area, it is directly fed by the gravity itself directly in the body of the airbrush. In an Hp-sb, the gravity will not allow the paint to make it's way inside the body, without any suction.

Originally Posted by fontgeek

If you can spray straight air through the brush without any issues, then you have eliminated the air passage, airvalve, etc., as being the cause for your problems. If you can't spray only air through your brush, then you have something interfering with the flow or passage route. That doesn't mean that that is the only issue, but eliminate whatever you can from the possibilities.

As I said previously I wasn't able to spray straight air trough the brush without hearing a small turbulence, so the liquid itself wasn't the issue. And now that every thing works just fine I can tell you again that every single part were analyzed with a magnifying glass, and every parts were perfect, so the issue was really something stuck in the air passage.

Originally Posted by fontgeek

If Iwata won't help, you can send it to me, I'll do what I can to fix it. My work will be free, but parts (if necessary) and shipping costs will be yours.

Thank's for your help, this was really kind ! I just didn't have the time to wait until you to try to repair it. I also wanted to swap every part from my new airbrush, that I will receive in few days, if the Ultrasonic cleaner wasn't working... Just to be sure that there was no hope for me to resolve the problem.

Thank's all for your help and support !

I'm glad you are getting a second brush. I'll be curious to hear if and what you replace that changes things to make it work.
If you trully have chrome peeling/breaking away inside your airbrush, then you can kiss it's usefulness goodbye. I would complain to Iwata, but because you have had it as long as you have, and done the things you listed, they may or may-not take it back under warranty. Doesn't hurt to ask them.

As far as the SB being ONLY a siphon feed brush, you are mistaken. If in doubt, put some airbrush ready paint in the cup, now unplug the cup from the airbrush. Do you see paint coming out the "straw"/feeder tube? I do on mine, and that means it is coming out without the siphon action you claim it requires, it's just good old gravity pushing it out. As the cup emptys the brush provides enough suction/siphon action to pull the last bit of paint out of the cup/reservoir. As I said the side feed SB model is primarily a gravity feed brush, but it does use some siphon assistance.